Quarantine takes toll on alcoholics

[GiriBang]

Summary:: Seriousness of withdrawal symptoms

Since, the people who went to buy alcohol didn't follow social distancing, all the bars were shut down.
As a result, many committed suicide, some started brewing alcohols illegally, some like this v
https://www.outlookindia.com/websit...alternatives-prove-fatal-in-tamil-nadu/350176
Most important of all some started facing serious withdrawal symptoms. So, what can be done to help them?

 

[BillTre]

 

[phinds]

Summary:: Seriousness of withdrawal symptoms

Since, the people who went to buy alcohol didn't follow social distancing, all the bars were shut down.
As a result, many committed suicide, some started brewing alcohols illegally, some like this v
https://www.outlookindia.com/websit...alternatives-prove-fatal-in-tamil-nadu/350176
Most important of all some started facing serious withdrawal symptoms. So, what can be done to help them?

Liquor stores are open (deemed essential) in many states.

 

[Evo]

Summary:: Seriousness of withdrawal symptoms

Since, the people who went to buy alcohol didn't follow social distancing, all the bars were shut down.
As a result, many committed suicide, some started brewing alcohols illegally, some like this v
https://www.outlookindia.com/websit...alternatives-prove-fatal-in-tamil-nadu/350176
Most important of all some started facing serious withdrawal symptoms. So, what can be done to help them?

That might be the case in some countries, but not all. In the US, liquor stores are still considered essential.

In New Zealand, purchase of beer and wine are still allowed in grocery stores.

In your country, that is something you'd need to bring up to the powers controlling things as to the wiseness of abruptly cutting off something that could cause problems and even death. I once saw an episode on TV where an alcoholic who could not get alcohol and was cut off cold turkey died from the abrupt cut off, it's called delirium tremens.

 

[Dr. Courtney]

That might be the case in some countries, but not all. In the US, liquor stores are still considered essential.

That's true in some states, but not in all:

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/co...stores-while-others-allow-cocktail-deliveries

 

[Evo]

That's true in some states, but not in all:

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/co...stores-while-others-allow-cocktail-deliveries

That's shameful and a complete disregard for the health/life of people used to drinking high amounts of alcohol. For medical reasons, you CANNOT just shut off their supply of alcohol.

Also, not all people that drink large quantities of alcohol, even on a daily basis are alcoholics. It's in the genes, I guess like addiction to drugs, how one person can take drugs and not get addicted while another taking the same amount gets addicted.

At least in the US, if your state bans alcohol, you can just drive to another state that doesn't.

Pennsylvania is the only Cray-cray state to close liquor stores?

According to your article

Last week, Wolf loosened his order a bit and, despite Pennsylvania still being the only state in the nation to totally close its brick-and-mortar liquor stores, allowed residents to purchase alcohol through the Liquor Control Board website and have it delivered to their homes.

 

[pinball1970]

That's shameful and a complete disregard for the health/life of people used to drinking high amounts of alcohol. For medical reasons, you CANNOT just shut off their supply of alcohol.

Also, not all people that drink large quantities of alcohol, even on a daily basis are alcoholics. It's in the genes, I guess like addiction to drugs, how one person can take drugs and not get addicted while another taking the same amount gets addicted.

At least in the US, if your state bans alcohol, you can just drive to another state that doesn't.

I went cold turkey.
I am not a alcoholic but I drink on a regular basis.
So no pub no socializing so no beer, I've also cut out junk food.
That's my thing.

UK broadly speaking no reports of beer shortages in off licences (liquor stores) or supermarkets so far although there have been some price rises. (Nothing I've seen on the news or from friends regarding shortages yet)

They could use beer left in pubs for registered/ clinical alcoholics but there is the issue of safe distribution

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52199185

Ordering off the net is if that is an option also home brew kits

Agreed that sudden cessation can lead to an unpleasant and or life threatening situation.

I am not sure how a GP would manage that situation. Librium?

Tricky.

 

[Evo]

I went cold turkey.
I am not a alcoholic but I drink on a regular basis.
So no pub no socializing so no beer, I've also cut out junk food.
That's my thing.

UK broadly speaking no reports of beer shortages in off licences (liquor stores) or supermarkets so far although there have been some price rises. (Nothing I've seen on the news or from friends regarding shortages yet)

They could use beer left in pubs for registered/ clinical alcoholics but there is the issue of safe distribution

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52199185

Ordering off the net is if that is an option also home brew kits

Agreed that sudden cessation can lead to an unpleasant and or life threatening situation.

I am not sure how a GP would manage that situation. Librium?

Tricky.

Well, only one state closed liquor stores, but offered online sales, also there was easy access to nearby states. So, as I said, liquor stores in the US are considered essential.

 

[phinds]

Well, only one state closed liquor stores, but offered online sales, also there was easy access to nearby states. So, as I said, liquor stores in the US are considered essential.

I thought more than just PA had closed but guess I was wrong. Anyway, counties near the PA line have started requiring proof of local citizenship because hoards of PA folks were swamping the stores and not even pretending to keep social distance.

 

[pinball1970]

Well, only one state closed liquor stores, but offered online sales, also there was easy access to nearby states. So, as I said, liquor stores in the US are considered essential.

Off licenses here rarely just have alcohol. They tend to sell bits of everything/essentials. Food some toiletries and basic medicines (pain killers, cough medicine etc)
Biggest issue here is actually getting to see a Dr face to face. Most appointments now are via phone unless emergency so I am not sure. how an alcoholic would fit in, in terms of priorities I do not know.

 

[DiracPool]

I am not a alcoholic but I drink on a regular basis.

Haha. I love that. That's my new line. I'm actually drinking a vodka tonic right now. I stocked up on a few gallons of Burnetts vodka to get through the caronavirus ordeal. I even bought a bunch of oatmeal and pasta and canned goods. Got in there too late for toilet paper, hand sanitizer, and condensed milk. But now they are back on the shelves. Whatever..

I think the doomsday preppers are laughing at us. Maybe deservedly so. I never owned a firearm because I thought there was a much higher probability that I would actually kill myself or a loved one in a friendly fire accident than disabling an intruder. But now I am going to buy one (maybe two) I think a handgun and a rifle, or a shotgun. Plus, I'm going to buy a camera surveillance system, maybe blink or ring?

BTW, Hi Evo.

 

[pinball1970]

Haha. I love that. That's my new line. I'm actually drinking a vodka tonic right now. I stocked up on a few gallons of Burnetts vodka to get through the caronavirus ordeal. I even bought a bunch of oatmeal and pasta and canned goods. Got in there too late for toilet paper, hand sanitizer, and condensed milk. But now they are back on the shelves. Whatever..

I think the doomsday preppers are laughing at us. Maybe deservedly so. I never owned a firearm because I thought there was a much higher probability that I would actually kill myself or a loved one in a friendly fire accident than disabling an intruder. But now I am going to buy one (maybe two) I think a handgun and a rifle, or a shotgun. Plus, I'm going to buy a camera surveillance system, maybe blink or ring?

BTW, Hi Evo.

It's not a line!

I think I may have had some issues by now if I was dependent. Perhaps you can start a new thread on that

My friends stocked up on beer whilst I was running round trying to find canned goods pasta bread and long life milk for my mother and sister.

I managed to get pasta yesterday for the first time since lock down at the local shop.

Wine beer and spirits shelves not empty at any point.

 

[Evo]

BTW, Hi Evo.

HI! I haven't been allowed to go shopping the last few weeks by my daughter, so I don't know what's actually on the shelves, although my neighbor said except for TP and paper towels, hand sanitizer. etc..., the store is pretty well stocked. He didn't know if they had flour yet because he hadn't looked for that, haven't been able to find flour for the last month!

 

[Evo]

I thought more than just PA had closed but guess I was wrong. Anyway, counties near the PA line have started requiring proof of local citizenship because hoards of PA folks were swamping the stores and not even pretending to keep social distance.

If you prohibit something, you create an instant desire to buy it. STUPID!

 

[phinds]

If you prohibit something, you create an instant desire to buy it. STUPID!

No argument there, but most liquor stores are fairly small places and the isles are not wide at all, so having very many people in one removes any likelihood of social distancing. I'm sure the gov. of PA means well.

 

[Evo]

No argument there, but most liquor stores are fairly small places and the isles are not wide at all, so having very many people in one removes any likelihood of social distancing. I'm sure the gov. of PA means well.

Well, other states had them set up stands in the parking lot. Luckily, my store already had a drive thru window.

 

[Dr. Courtney]

If you prohibit something, you create an instant desire to buy it. STUPID!

Not just buying. You should have seen all the people on the lake the day before we thought they might close the boat ramps. Fortunately, GA did not follow the example of SC and WA. Still making groceries at the lake today.

 

[Evo]

Not just buying. You should have seen all the people on the lake the day before we thought they might close the boat ramps. Fortunately, GA did not follow the example of SC and WA. Still making groceries at the lake today.
View attachment 260669

Nice fish!

I miss going fishing and crabbing with my mother.

 

[pinball1970]

Well, other states had them set up stands in the parking lot. Luckily, my store already had a drive thru window.

Part of Ireland has found a work around
https://www.irishpost.com/news/belf...hly-poured-guinness-door-door-lockdown-183328

 

[DennisN]

For medical reasons, you CANNOT just shut off their supply of alcohol.

If I remember correctly, alcohol is one of the comparatively few drug types that when going "cold turkey" can actually be deadly. There is another drug type that is quite common, where going "cold turkey" can be deadly, but I don't remember which it was.

 

[DiracPool]

HI! I haven't been allowed to go shopping the last few weeks by my daughter, so I don't know what's actually on the shelves, although my neighbor said except for TP and paper towels, hand sanitizer. etc..., the store is pretty well stocked. He didn't know if they had flour yet because he hadn't looked for that, haven't been able to find flour for the last month!

It's crazy what people covet in an emergency?! I don't get it. In my undergrad years at the frat, we used to run out of toilet paper all the time. No prob, just jump in the shower? Why so important now?

 

[russ_watters]

Pennsylvania is the only Cray-cray state to close liquor stores?

Note that as of a couple of years ago we can buy limited amounts of beer and wine in grocery stores. So you can still drink, if just takes more effort (if you're usually a hard liqueur drinker).

 

[pinball1970]

If I remember correctly, alcohol is one of the comparatively few drug types that when going "cold turkey" can actually be deadly. There is another drug type that is quite common, where going "cold turkey" can be deadly, but I don't remember which it was.

Benzodiazapines? Probably heroin too

 

[BillTre]

Except for Guinness I got for my birthday, I am only buying Corona beer now.
If I could go to a bar (closed) it would be: "I'll have a Corona, hold the virus".

Liquor stores are still open here, and so are the pot shops.

People going into an alcoholic withdrawal may have to go into the hospital. Some die.
Heroin (and maybe other opiates) is another drug that can have lethal withdrawal consequences.

 

[DennisN]

Benzodiazapines?

That was one of the types I thought of, but I wasn't sure I remembered correctly, so I didn't want to say it. I'm rarely here in the Biology/Medical forum, I just happened to stray in here and see this thread.

 

[Nick-stg]

The cannabis stores are open in Quebec and Ontario, and most likely in other Canadian provinces as well. So are the liquor stores. But all are closed on Sundays.

 

[DiracPool]

People going into an alcoholic withdrawal may have to go into the hospital. Some die.
Heroin (and maybe other opiates) is another drug that can have lethal withdrawal consequences.

You are such an amatuer, my friend Bill. I, having been a party casualty of the 80's have been through all of these withdrawals hundreds of times.

The myth that chronic alcoholics undergoing withdrawal or detox and having seizures is largely a myth. The current thinking is that this is a very small minority of people who have some genetic disposition for this. As far as opiate addiction, I've been there too. Practically, nobody ever died from heroin withdrawal, although they wished they were dead while undergoing it. Check it out.

As far as the benzos, I heard that detox was dangerous so I never really developed a habit with those.

 

[BillTre]

Well I know a guy who was in the hospital for several weeks last year, and was in danger of dying, due to alcohol detox. (Arrested after a drunk driving incident).
I used to drink a far amount, but not like that guy.
You may not have been addicted enough to alcohol for these affects.

 

[DiracPool]

HI! I haven't been allowed to go shopping the last few weeks by my daughter, so I don't know what's actually on the shelves, although my neighbor said except for TP and paper towels, hand sanitizer. etc..., the store is pretty well stocked. He didn't know if they had flour yet because he hadn't looked for that, haven't been able to find flour for the last month!

Fortunately for me, I'm on the ketogenic diet, I haven't seen a bag of flour in years. I have no idea why in a viral pandemic people would make a run on bleached flour. haha.

 

[pinball1970]

Fortunately for me, I'm on the ketogenic diet, I haven't seen a bag of flour in years. I have no idea why in a viral pandemic people would make a run on bleached flour. haha.

Heavy drinkers, alcoholics and regular social drinkers who consume sensible units and cut down when they need to stocked up on beer and home brew kits.
Others may have envisaged a bread shortage stocked up on brewers yeast and flour.
I hit the shops for tuna and pasta but was too late by a week or so.

I had to settle for all the expensive and instant noodles that have a higher fat content.

 

[jim mcnamara]

This thread has interesting information, but lots of personal experience. Which is okay, but not really what the science only part of PF supports. So in the interest of keeping it unlocked, let's move it to General Discussion.

 

[Klystron]

While I think our governor exempted cannabis and liquor stores from mandatory closure, the former have closed walk in storefronts in favor of home delivery.

My doctor recently recommended CBD tincture and topical ointments for arthritis. While our grocery stores stock CBD treatments, I have been informed that the cannabis stores stock higher quality local products, though at higher tax rates.

I am pleased how well the CBD extracts work on affected muscles and joints. Been running an informal experiment by rubbing hydrocortisone cream on one side, CBD cream on the other for comparison. The sublingual CBD tinctures affect the entire body, naturally; but without the mental changes typical of THC products.

For those seeking psycho-active highs every form of state approved cannabis is available at one's door with tinctures, extracts and edibles for wise folk eschewing vape and smoke. Save your lungs; you may need them.

Alcohol in every popular form is readily available at every corner grocery store; 28/8 as my son likes to say (twice on Sundays). The liquor section dimensions of most stores exceed other departments except fresh produce. Nonetheless, a local immigrant family has opened giant liquor emporiums in every neighborhood of Our Fair City to great success alongside 'big box' stores that literally sell crates of massive liquor bottles. Shuttered restaurants and bars have been allowed to deliver alcoholic drinks along with food.

Like most sane locals I try to limit my intake of every good thing, especially given our trying times. Exercise instead of ecstasy. Reading posts from libation deprived members, I understand the appeal of our fair city. Come enjoy the ambiance; once travel restrictions relax, of course.

 

[Dr. Courtney]

The liquor stores near me haven't really been any better about social distancing and the handling of common items than other retail stores, like Walmart and Academy sports.

At the same time, the real "need" for the product is most likely a much smaller segment of the population than the segment of the population really needing groceries.

This level of medical need can almost be certainly be met by opening up home delivery from liquor stores to customers and maintaining other channels that need to be kept open for food (groceries, take out, and food delivery).

In areas where the COVID-19 rates are high enough to justify closure of retail outlets like liquor stores, the needs of folks for whom alcohol is a medical necessity can be met through other avenues.

 

[pinball1970]

Well I know a guy who was in the hospital for several weeks last year, and was in danger of dying, due to alcohol detox. (Arrested after a drunk driving incident).
I used to drink a far amount, but not like that guy.
You may not have been addicted enough to alcohol for these affects.

My friend suffered similar. He has episodes of wretching that can last for hours which then lead to withdrawal

That's shameful and a complete disregard for the health/life of people used to drinking high amounts of alcohol. For medical reasons, you CANNOT just shut off their supply of alcohol.

Also, not all people that drink large quantities of alcohol, even on a daily basis are alcoholics. It's in the genes, I guess like addiction to drugs, how one person can take drugs and not get addicted while another taking the same amount gets addicted.

At least in the US, if your state bans alcohol, you can just drive to another state that doesn't.

Pennsylvania is the only Cray-cray state to close liquor stores?

According to your article

One way of avoiding shortage also in Pennsylvania

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/14/us/coors-light-delivery-trnd/index.html

 

[chemisttree]

At least in the US, if your state bans alcohol, you can just drive to another state that doesn't.

Maybe that’s why Texas didn’t shut down the alcoholic, er... liquor stores. From where I am in San Antonio it’s a six-hour drive in any direction to get to another state. And, of course, once in that “state”, the drive home is a lot longer.