Degeneracy of the 3d harmonic oscillator

In summary, the conversation discussed the calculation of degeneracy for a 3D harmonic oscillator and the formula for its eigenvalues. The formula for degeneracy was derived and found to be (1/2)(n+1)(n+2). The conversation also mentioned the possibility of accidental degeneracy in the case of the cubic infinite square well.
  • #1
mavyn
7
0
Hi!

I'm trying to calculate the degeneracy of each state for 3D harmonic oscillator.
The eigenvalues are

En = (N + 3/2) hw

Unfortunately I didn't find this topic in my textbook.
Can somebody help me?
 
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  • #2
What does the "N" operator look like? Is it just [tex]a^\dagger a[/tex] or something else?
 
  • #3
StatMechGuy said:
What does the "N" operator look like? Is it just [tex]a^\dagger a[/tex] or something else?

Hi,
sorry I made a mistake in the formula. It should be

En = (n + 3/2) hw
 
  • #4
[itex]n[/itex] is the sum of 3 quantum numbers, [itex]n_x, n_y, n_z[/itex]; for the lowest rung, which is [itex]n=0[/itex], there's no degeneracy. For [itex]n=1[/itex], there's 3 fold degeneracy (one of the quantum numbers is 1, and rest is 0). For [itex]n=2[/itex], there's 6 fold degenertacy (one of them may be 2 and rest 0, or two of them may be 1) and so on. The result is, for nth energy level, there's 3n degeneracy.
 
  • #5
gulsen said:
[itex]n[/itex] is the sum of 3 quantum numbers, [itex]n_x, n_y, n_z[/itex]; for the lowest rung, which is [itex]n=0[/itex], there's no degeneracy. For [itex]n=1[/itex], there's 3 fold degeneracy (one of the quantum numbers is 1, and rest is 0). For [itex]n=2[/itex], there's 6 fold degenertacy (one of them may be 2 and rest 0, or two of them may be 1) and so on. The result is, for nth energy level, there's 3n degeneracy.

Thanks for the answer!
 
  • #6
Watch out!

No that's not right.
You can't work it out for the first couple of cases and then presume the trend continues like that.
In fact, the degeneracy g(n) is:
g(n) = (1/2)(n+1)(n+2)
 
  • #7
014137 said:
No that's not right.
You can't work it out for the first couple of cases and then presume the trend continues like that.
In fact, the degeneracy g(n) is:
g(n) = (1/2)(n+1)(n+2)

And even this, I think, is nt completely right. There are some levels with additional accidental degeneracy which don't fit the pattern.
 
  • #8
Really? Which ones?
The formula can be derived like this:
n = n1 + n2 + n3
where 1,2,3 are three orthogonal directions.
Choose n1 then
n2 + n3 = n - n1
Can always pick n - n1 + 1 different pairs of n2, n3.
Sum over n1 from 0 to n:

Sum(n - n1 +1) = Sum(n - 1) - Sum(n1)
=(n - 1)*(n - 1) - (1/2)n(n + 1)
=(1/2)(n+1)(n+2)

Maybe there's a mistake somewhere?
 
  • #9
014137 said:
Really? Which ones?
The formula can be derived like this:
n = n1 + n2 + n3
where 1,2,3 are three orthogonal directions.
Choose n1 then
n2 + n3 = n - n1
Can always pick n - n1 + 1 different pairs of n2, n3.
Sum over n1 from 0 to n:

Sum(n - n1 +1) = Sum(n - 1) - Sum(n1)
=(n - 1)*(n - 1) - (1/2)n(n + 1)
=(1/2)(n+1)(n+2)

Maybe there's a mistake somewhere?
I was thinking about the cubic infinite square well which is more tricky since it involves the sum of squares, so never mind my comment about accidental degeneracy.

Your formula may be right but I don't understand how you got from (n - 1)*(n - 1) - (1/2)n(n + 1) to (1/2)(n+1)(n+2). Those two expressions are not equal. Moreover, the sum [itex] \sum_{n_1 = 0}^n [/itex] gives (n+1), not (n-1), right?

EDIT: Actually, the formula does not seem to work. I may have missed some states, but I can't get it to work for n=10, say.
 
Last edited:
  • #10
sorry - i was being silly
Sum(n - n1 +1) = Sum(n + 1) - Sum(n1)
=(n + 1)*(n + 1) - (1/2)n(n + 1)
=(1/2)(n+1)(n+2)
 
  • #11
Does work for n = 10, look:
State
3 x 10, 0, 0
3 x 8, 1, 1
3 x 6, 2, 2
3 x 4, 3, 3
3 x 2, 4, 4
3 x 0, 5, 5
6 x 9, 1, 0
6 x 8, 2, 0
6 x 7, 3, 0
6 x 7, 2, 1
6 x 6, 4, 0
6 x 6, 3, 1
6 x 5, 4, 1
6 x 5, 3, 2
Degeneracy = 6 x 8 + 3 x 6 = 6 x 11 = 66

The formula for g(n) gives (1/2)*(11)*(12) = 66

So it works.
 
Last edited:
  • #12
014137 said:
Does work for n = 10, look:
State
3 x 10, 0, 0
3 x 8, 1, 1
3 x 6, 2, 2
3 x 4, 3, 3
3 x 2, 4, 4
3 x 0, 5, 5
6 x 9, 1, 0
6 x 8, 2, 0
6 x 7, 3, 0
6 x 7, 2, 1
6 x 6, 4, 0
6 x 6, 3, 1
6 x 5, 4, 1
6 x 5, 3, 2
Degeneracy = 6 x 8 + 3 x 6 = 6 x 11 = 66

The formula for g(n) gives (1/2)*(11)*(12) = 66

So it works.


Yes, you are completely right. I had missed one entry.
Good job. Thanks for the correction.

If you know a formula for the infinite cubic well, let me know...It's in that case that accidental degeneracy are a killer.

Regards

Patrick
 
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  • #13
Thank you everyone.. i too was stuck in it and it helped me a lot
 

Related to Degeneracy of the 3d harmonic oscillator

1. What is degeneracy in the context of the 3d harmonic oscillator?

Degeneracy refers to the phenomenon in which two or more states of a system have the same energy. In the case of the 3d harmonic oscillator, degeneracy occurs when multiple energy levels have the same energy value.

2. How does degeneracy affect the energy spectrum of the 3d harmonic oscillator?

Degeneracy causes the energy spectrum of the 3d harmonic oscillator to have multiple energy levels with the same energy value. This results in a more complex energy spectrum compared to non-degenerate systems.

3. What factors contribute to the degeneracy of the 3d harmonic oscillator?

The degeneracy of the 3d harmonic oscillator is primarily influenced by the symmetry of the system. The more symmetrical the system, the higher the degeneracy is likely to be. Other factors such as the potential energy and angular momentum also play a role in determining the degeneracy.

4. How does degeneracy affect the behavior of the 3d harmonic oscillator?

Degeneracy can impact the dynamics of the 3d harmonic oscillator by affecting the probability of a system transitioning to a different energy level. In some cases, degeneracy may result in a system remaining in a certain energy level for a longer period of time.

5. Can degeneracy be observed in other physical systems besides the 3d harmonic oscillator?

Yes, degeneracy is a common phenomenon in many physical systems and is not limited to the 3d harmonic oscillator. Examples include atoms, molecules, and other quantum mechanical systems.

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