Chi Meson's Home Solar System Success Story

[IMP]

I plan on installing a similar system on my house, I am still waiting for the panel prices to come down. Panel prices are still way too high for me.

 

[Drakkith]

This is one of those FYI eye opening moments, what is going on here ?


Rhody...

Looks like normal business to me.

 

[rhody]

This is one of those FYI eye opening moments, what is going on here ?

Looks like normal business to me.

Aww, I just went to the WSJ link I posted, those sneaky devils substituted my original first informative page, with basically nothing. I value the WSJ, but when hidden behind a pay wall it provides those that don't subscribe with a tease or next to nothing as in this case. Here is another link. Same old story, cheap foreign imports undercutting US products.

Sorry about the WSJ bait and switch I won't use their links from now on. Live and learn.

Rhody...

 

[Drakkith]

Hmm. The Air Force won't let me get to the new link. Oh well. Still, just looks like normal business to me. This isn't the first industry that this has happened to, and it won't be the last.

 

[fluidistic]

Lovely, very nice Chi Meson! You just realized my dream, though I'd have to realize my girlfriend's dream first: getting a house.
I with the physics department here had this. I rarely see any cloud, no snow and too much Sun for me. Would be awesome. Maybe I could propose this to a professor as a non serious suggestion just to hear what he thinks.

 

[OmCheeto]

Aww, I just went to the WSJ link I posted, those sneaky devils substituted my original first informative page, with basically nothing. I value the WSJ, but when hidden behind a pay wall it provides those that don't subscribe with a tease or next to nothing as in this case. Here is another link. Same old story, cheap foreign imports undercutting US products.

Sorry about the WSJ bait and switch I won't use their links from now on. Live and learn.

Rhody...

You realize of course, that they are simply trying to obfuscate the obvious:

http://current.com/groups/news-blog/93596121_big-business-behind-solar-power.htm
the fourth in a series of five Underreported Stories of 2011
...
Google's investments in clean energy projects exceed $925 million, including more than $880 million since the beginning of this year. Google said Tuesday that these investments aim to produce 1.7 gigawatts of power and provide electricity to 350,000 houses.

Even oil companies are getting into the solar game. French oil powerhouse Total AG bought SunPower for $1.37 billion.

Whether or not a single company succeeds or fails(Solyndra) is irrelevant. Confusing people with the intention of forcing down stock prices in progressive technologies makes those stocks a bargain, and those who don't buy the panic, rich.

In any event, everyone should invest in the future that they want, for their grand nieces and nephews.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Aww, I just went to the WSJ link I posted, those sneaky devils substituted my original first informative page, with basically nothing. I value the WSJ, but when hidden behind a pay wall it provides those that don't subscribe with a tease or next to nothing as in this case. Here is another link. Same old story, cheap foreign imports undercutting US products.

Sorry about the WSJ bait and switch I won't use their links from now on. Live and learn.

Rhody...

Consider the track record of the new owners. Is it any wonder the staff was in rebellion, and many walked, when the company was sold?

 

[OmCheeto]

Consider the track record of the new owners. Is it any wonder the staff was in rebellion, and many walked, when the company was sold?

I smell the aroma of 2012 around the corner...

Gads, what a grand last year it will be!

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I smell the aroma of 2012 around the corner...

Gads, what a grand last year it will be!

Last year, sure, but then Obama starts his second term.

 

[OmCheeto]

Last year, sure, but then Obama starts his second term.

I hope they have pity on us on New Years eve.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/38263_137192422981773_137192249648457_235622_3524152_n.jpg

Topic: Gone Solar

Ends up: Mayan Calendar portending the end of the world.

meh. close enough. (hic!) HNY!1!111!

 

[Chi Meson]

Y'know, the panels have been up for more than a month, and they still haven't been switched on!

I had to wait for the Electrician to hook up the inverter so that...

...the town could inspect the installation, so that ...

...the state could inspect the installation and specs, so that...

...the power company (Connecticut Light and Power) could drop by and throw the switch.

Each visit takes place according top New England Handyman Professional rules (that is, "I'll be there as soon as I feel like it"), toss in Thanksgiving & Christmas vacation weeks in between, add the fact that I'm still waiting for CLP, the people who will stop getting money from me as soon as they throw the switch, and...

I'm still waiting!

 

[rhody]

Good luck Chi, hopefully it all goes smoothly and you will be making KW's soon and saving some money as well.

Rhody...

 

[Chi Meson]

Update:
First week of April and they are producing above 7kW. I was just watching half an hour ago as it hit 7300 W. I went to take out my phone to take a picture, then a wee bit o' haze sneaked in taking it down to 7030 W.

Some back story: it was only producing a max of 2kW all the way through January and February. I thought it was a seasonal thing, due to the til of the roof, but when it was March, and still only making 2kW, I called the installer. Turns out, they forgot to connect a wire! The entire grid over the garage was not connected! I've been getting less than half the kWh for two months!

Nitwits!

 

[Pengwuino]

Glad to hear you're producing some real power :) How many kWh per month do you think you're producing when it's at it's correct power output?

 

[rhody]

Update:
Turns out, they forgot to connect a wire! The entire grid over the garage was not connected! I've been getting less than half the kWh for two months!

Nitwits!

Chi finds missing Dark Energy, news at 11. Seriously, though, did your specs tell you that you should be generating over 5 Kw ?
Ought ohh, look who is before my post ! Pengy, a rare site these days.

Rhody...

 

[dlgoff]

Turns out, they forgot to connect a wire! The entire grid over the garage was not connected! I've been getting less than half the kWh for two months!

Nitwits!

I'd be pissed. Maybe you should prorate their pay.

 

[Chi Meson]

Glad to hear you're producing some real power :) How many kWh per month do you think you're producing when it's at it's correct power output?

I should have 7 months over 800 kWh, with 3 of them over 900 kWh. Mid-December to Mid January will dip to about 400 kWh. The first year should be more than that, since panels decrease in efficiency by 10% . So far, the first 30-days-fully-conected will easily break 800.

 

[Chi Meson]

Milestone: April 13, first time breaking 40 kWh in one day.

 

[mheslep]

The highest efficiency so far is now over 20%. The breakthrough was something like silver nanoglobules added to the surface. Not exactly on the cheap shelf yet.

Over 40% in the lab or on Mars rover. Off the shelf tops out at 20%.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...eff(rev120404).jpg/660px-PVeff(rev120404).jpg

 

[Chi Meson]

Over 40% in the lab or on Mars rover. Off the shelf tops out at 20%.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...eff(rev120404).jpg/660px-PVeff(rev120404).jpg

NASA is still keeping Alien technology for itself. jerks.

 

[Redbelly98]

Over 40% in the lab or on Mars rover. Off the shelf tops out at 20%.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...eff(rev120404).jpg/660px-PVeff(rev120404).jpg

NASA is still keeping Alien technology for itself. jerks.

Or they are available to anybody who can afford them. Perhaps they're outrageously expensive, but still cheaper than the cost of the extra rocket fuel required to hoist larger, heavier, less efficient cells into orbit.

Disclaimer: this is simply a reasonable guess on my part.

 

[Chi Meson]

Update:

Yesterday the system surpassed 5 MWh. I'll be on track to smash the 7MWh per year expectation. According to the law as it stands, I do not get credit for a net positive yearly production; the best I am allowed is to break even. Since the system is leased, the actual owners might be under a different law. I tried to read the legal jargon, but I fell into a coma.

My only recourse is to use MORE electricity! How [messed up] is that?

Interesting observation: the highest level of production is during March/April, where the power went over 7000W under full sun. The heat of May, June, July, August keeps the power near 6000W maximum, but this lasts for 8 to 10 hours. Record for kWh/day: 48

 

[ZapperZ]

Yesterday the system surpassed 5 MWh. I'll be on track to smash the 7MWh per year expectation. According to the law as it stands, I do not get credit for a net positive yearly production; the best I am allowed is to break even. Since the system is leased, the actual owners might be under a different law. I tried to read the legal jargon, but I fell into a coma.

My only recourse is to use MORE electricity! How [messed up] is that?

That IS utterly messed up!

Thanks for the update. Is this the only place where we can get update on your progress, or do you blog your experience elsewhere also? It's very interesting to read what you are doing and going through, and I'm following it closely.

Zz.

 

[IMP]

...My only recourse is to use MORE electricity! How [messed up] is that?

Maybe it is time for a Nissan Leaf?

 

[Chi Meson]

This is it. I do not blog.

I. do. not. blog.

I use facebook primarily for communication with my robotics team, but PF is my only "community" online. Lucky You!

I've just found out that the grid inter-tie will prevent me from using solar during an area blackout. The inverter is very, very sensitive, and can only switch on after analyzing the incoming grid for 5 minutes (it's got to be synchronized precisely). I'm wondering if I can trick it by plugging in a gas generator.

 

[Chi Meson]

Maybe it is time for a Nissan Leaf?

That, or plug in Prius, or Chevy Volt... yes, I have moved that consideration way up the ladder.

 

[rootX]

I love this thread!

I've just found out that the grid inter-tie will prevent me from using solar during an area blackout. The inverter is very, very sensitive, and can only switch on after analyzing the incoming grid for 5 minutes (it's got to be synchronized precisely). I'm wondering if I can trick it by plugging in a gas generator.

It might be because of islanding concerns http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islanding#Islanding_basics

 

[Chi Meson]

I love this thread!

It might be because of islanding concerns http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islanding#Islanding_basics

Well, that's Wikipedia for you. A much more coherent and understandable explanation than the technical papers I was given. The safety concerns in my techie literature are treated as foregone conclusions, though. Wiki says "meh."

 

[dlgoff]

Maybe you could have a line installed and metered to one of your neighbors then sell them a little power?

 

[OmCheeto]

This is it. I do not blog.

I. do. not. blog.

I use facebook primarily for communication with my robotics team, but PF is my only "community" online. Lucky You!

I've just found out that the grid inter-tie will prevent me from using solar during an area blackout. The inverter is very, very sensitive, and can only switch on after analyzing the incoming grid for 5 minutes (it's got to be synchronized precisely). I'm wondering if I can trick it by plugging in a gas generator.

How about a $40 inverter run off of a $60 deep cycle battery kept charged by a single panel?

Solutions are $100 a dozen.

Though you'd need a solid disconnect from the grid. I'm pretty sure that's why they designed them the way yours is.

...

Have you ever connected a pair of multi-kilo/megawatt power sources out of phase before?

No?

Well, neither have I.

Though I did shoot a plasma fireball across the aux-room one day, about 30+ years ago...

450 vac x 1200 amps = BOOM!

We survived.

 

[Chi Meson]

Though I did shoot a plasma fireball across the aux-room one day, about 30+ years ago...

450 vac x 1200 amps = BOOM!

We survived.

I must try that!

 

[dlgoff]

Have you ever connected a pair of multi-kilo/megawatt power sources out of phase before?
...

Though I did shoot a plasma fireball across the aux-room one day, about 30+ years ago...

450 vac x 1200 amps = BOOM!

We survived.

Ever put a screwdriver blade across a pair of 440 volt phases?

I did. Screwdriver blade plasma fireball in my hands.

 

[I_am_learning]

I should have 7 months over 800 kWh, with 3 of them over 900 kWh. Mid-December to Mid January will dip to about 400 kWh. The first year should be more than that, since panels decrease in efficiency by 10% . So far, the first 30-days-fully-conected will easily break 800.

Total Money Earned in a Year
(7*800 + 3*900 + 2*400)*0.18$ = 1638$/yr
(or is it 0.55$/Kwh ?)
Total Money Paid
For Panels: 109$*12 = 1308$
For Electricity Use during Night + Cloudy Day = ?

Really, you should consider Selling it to neighbor at low rates, if the power company won't allow you go beyond break even.

I would like to hear more about the economic aspects.
Thanks.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Though I did shoot a plasma fireball across the aux-room one day, about 30+ years ago...

450 vac x 1200 amps = BOOM!

We survived.

Ever put a screwdriver blade across a pair of 440 volt phases?

I did. Screwdriver blade plasma fireball in my hands.

I once crossed a screwdriver on live 480 3-phase line. Same thing, the screwdriver was just a fireball. I was incredibly lucky. Turned out a physician had turned on the power! Never considered that one and we didn't have a lockout at that clinic. In fact, I didn't even know he was in there. I just happened to be holding the wires by the insulation when he turned on the power.

As for the current, typical industrial circuit breakers can take up to three cycle before they break. I would have to look to be sure of the numbers but this was typically true of high amp fuses as well - say a 400 amp fuse. So until the breaker cuts or the fuse burns, you can pull tens or even hundreds of thousands of amps for a short time depending on the facility. This is why parallel power cables can be so dangerous. In a failure mode, the repulsive forces between the cables can be lethal.

 

[gravenewworld]

Nice, now all you have to do is get a car like the Nissan Leaf and you can be almost entirely energy independent.