Quietly Pump Water 11ft - Ideas for Sump Pump Solutions

[Danger]

I live about 3400 km to your west

So... what, somewhere between Brooks and Calgary? I didn't know that there were people there... :p

 

[RonL]

So... what, somewhere between Brooks and Calgary? I didn't know that there were people there... :p

They are all dressed like boats:D

 

[Danger]

They are all dressed like boats:D

Prairie schooners...?

 

[OmCheeto]

It would be good to use the battery system two or three times a year (just enough to drop charge to around 70 or 80 percent, or DOC, "depth of charge") this is the phrase "cycling a battery".
Exercising a battery is the same principal as exercising our physical bodies.;)

Edit...that should be DoD " Depth of Discharge"

Agreed.

One peculiar thing about the charging system, is that it claims to take 100 hours to charge a 100 ah battery. And I don't see anything in the literature about an equalizing charge. To my knowledge, batteries don't "gas" at below 14.4 vdc. If the system never forces the battery to gas, then stratification is going to occur. This will also degrade the life of a battery.

I would recommend rocking the battery back and forth for a couple of minutes, about every 6 months. This might solve the problem. Just make sure the caps are on tight. Battery acid will eat your eyeballs.

ps. I wonder if Wagon Master killed himself with his battery project. He hasn't been back since. DIY science projects can be deadly.

 

[Danger]

I wonder if Wagon Master killed himself with his battery project. He hasn't been back since. DIY science projects can be deadly.

Hmmm... possibly.
Re-reading that thread, I just can't believe that I didn't make a smart-ass response to his statement that "My father has a solar system..." I assume that Jupiter is the guest house...?

 

[RonL]

Agreed.

One peculiar thing about the charging system, is that it claims to take 100 hours to charge a 100 ah battery. And I don't see anything in the literature about an equalizing charge. To my knowledge, batteries don't "gas" at below 14.4 vdc. If the system never forces the battery to gas, then stratification is going to occur. This will also degrade the life of a battery.

I would recommend rocking the battery back and forth for a couple of minutes, about every 6 months. This might solve the problem. Just make sure the caps are on tight. Battery acid will eat your eyeballs.

ps. I wonder if Wagon Master killed himself with his battery project. He hasn't been back since. DIY science projects can be deadly.

I'm glad you linked to the battery project thread (your first post...WOW I like)
Batteries and compressed air...two things I'm passionate about and now have to really really hold my thoughts,...lest I be banned:)

 

[Danger]

Batteries and compressed air...two things I'm passionate about and now have to really really hold my thoughts,...lest I be banned:)

Oh, go ahead. A little flatulence never hurt anyone... :D

 

[RonL]

Oh, go ahead. A little flatulence never hurt anyone... :D

Your my red flag indicator, don't do what Danger does, try to stay at least 1" shy of the line:)

 

[Danger]

Your my red flag indicator, don't do what Danger does, try to stay at least 1" shy of the line:)

Wise words, my son.

 

[OmCheeto]

Oh, go ahead. A little flatulence never hurt anyone... :D

That was very much what I said in my very first thread!

I suppose, it was all Woolies fault, that I've stuck around this long.

 

[Danger]

Jeez, Om... you have got to stop linking to old threads. Every time you get me laughing that hard, I have to crank up the lpm's on my oxygen generator.

 

[RonL]

That was very much what I said in my very first thread!

I suppose, it was all Woolies fault, that I've stuck around this long.

I see it ended with a Danger sign:D

 

[Danger]

I see it ended with a Danger sign:D

A lot of threads have died on my account...

 

[dragoneyes001]

not sure this was added yet. has all the PVC been insulation wrapped to dull tube water sounds? there is 2/2.5/3 inch pipe insulation you simply slip on and tape the seem its about 3/4" thicker than the pipe. costs very little per foot and would mean rehanging the pipe with strapping but should reduce a large amount of shudder and flush sounds

 

[gloo]

not sure this was added yet. has all the PVC been insulation wrapped to dull tube water sounds? there is 2/2.5/3 inch pipe insulation you simply slip on and tape the seem its about 3/4" thicker than the pipe. costs very little per foot and would mean rehanging the pipe with strapping but should reduce a large amount of shudder and flush sounds

Where would I buy that ? Home depot?

Thanks dragoneyes001

 

[dragoneyes001]

toronto? yeah Home depot may have the larger pipe insulation. if not a local plumbing supply store will.

 

[Danger]

Home depot?

They certainly should have it; Home Hardware does for sure, because that's where I bought mine. I imagine that just about any place with plumbing supplies should suffice... Revy, Plumbfull Warehouse, etc..

edit: Sorry to step on your toes, Dragoneyes. I didn't notice you responding for a while, so I sneaked in. Then you double-sneaked and got in ahead of me anyhow.

 

[dragoneyes001]

was going to say rona but not sure they have rona in ontario

 

[Danger]

not sure they have rona in ontario

Yeah, me neither. It used to be Rona/Revy here, and now just Revy. Does Rona still exist as an entity?

 

[Shannon hunt]

You need to find the constant fill rate of the sump and buy the right pump I suggest varda pumps they are excellent very quite stainless in the important parts if you want a trickle flow get a pump with a low flow rate all the pump packs will have charts , but my suggestion would still be a high quality pump and float , moving parts precision counts you will get less noise and a power supply timer to regulate run times , believe it or not most of the bigger pumps make less noise then the budget pond pumps ,depending on size of sump get the required pump and float you will need to make a stepped well so float never sits lower than pump and I suggest go as.big as you can afford both price and fit and don't use hard PVC use hd poly ( blue line the fittings are push fit and absorb some movement also use pipe clamps on rubber bases these will help eliminate pipe chatter hope this helps : 4893633, member: 15808"]Yes, for a properly rated sump pump.

But he's talking about quiet little aquarium water pumps. What will be the flow rate for a 12 foot head?

Even pond pumps rarely have more than a 4-6 foot head. Imagine the power of a pond pump that can generate a fountain 12 feet high? (there are calculators for such things)[/QUOTE]

 

[Danger]

Shannon, will you please buy a new " . " key for your computer? I'm going cross-eyed here...

 

[Norm Morin]

I need help with ideas on how to pump water our of a sump pump that is always filling up. Using a sump pump when the float is tripped is really load. I need something that quietly pumps the water out steadily while not using up huge power...but it needs to be quiet!

I see these aquarium pumps:

http://www.tetra-fish.com/Products/aquarium-air-pumps/whisper-air-pumps.aspx

They seem to be used for pumping air into aquariums. But I don't think they pump the water upward. I need something that will quietly, and efficiently pump upwards about 11 feet. I need this to run 24 hours.

Can someone tell me how i can convert this air pump to make water pump up 11 feet?

The key to any solution is correctly identifying the problem. From your post, I'm thinking your problem is twofold. The noise and the high load on the pump when it starts up. Noise is a result of vibration transferring to the air. As has been previously mentioned, submerging the pump can be a great way to dampen the pump vibrations. There are also plenty of acoustic dampening solutions out there, just google acoustic dampening. There are also vibration dampening materials available to isolate machine vibration from anchor points if you anchor the pump to your foundation as that can actually amplify vibration. Here's an example, just google search machine vibration isolation for more. http://www.globalindustrial.ca/c/fa...FO-zapOSqVBseegJtIGBWmpbTW4fzt3Ti0aAunM8P8HAQ
Additionally, a significant amount of machine vibration can be controlled by proper design, balancing and alignment.

Lastly, to address your high start up loads. Having a capacitor start motor will help with the current required on start up. An important consideration on pump selection is whether your flow rates into the sump are relatively constant or not. Obviously if you have large surges it will affect selection of a pumps peak capacity. The frequency of start/stop cycles will be affected by a few factors. The best design would have a pump operating within its optimal efficiency all the time, rather than cycling. If you have a variable inflow rate you have to deal with you can moderate that by having a large sump to average out your outflow requirements. Once your outflow rate is reasonably stable, you can select a pump that can handle the required flow efficiently. I don't think an aquarium pump is your best solution as they are not the most efficient.One very simple and relatively inexpensive flow control solution on a variable flow problem without significant flow variation is to have centrifugal pump sized to handle average peak flow requirements connected to a tall inlet side head tank. As inlet head rises or lowers output flow on a centrifugal pump automatically increases or decreases according to the pumps design curve (With a corresponding change in electrical current to the motor). The beauty of this is that if sized correctly, the pump will never stop, will automatically adjust it's flow rate as water rises or lowers in the sump, and it will run at or near its peak efficiency rating and thus you will rarely have high start up loads on your electrical system. Here's one example of an efficiency curve for a pump as well as some great information on factors affecting efficiencies to help you select the right pump for the right job. http://www.waterworld.com/articles/print/volume-26/issue-12/departments/pump-tips-techniques/how-to-select-a-pump-with-the-highest-efficiency.html

Hope this helps, feel free to email me if you require more information.

 

[magnetic_mike]

You can make a quiet water pump by using a 1 inch dia pvc pipe. Make a .999 inch dia auger that is as long as the pipe. Put one end in the well and the other end is driven by a windmill. The wind blows and turns the auger/shaft inside the tube drawing the water out

 

[Danger]

You can make a quiet water pump by using a 1 inch dia pvc pipe. Make a .999 inch dia auger that is as long as the pipe. Put one end in the well and the other end is driven by a windmill. The wind blows and turns the auger/shaft inside the tube drawing the water out

That seems like a really good idea: Archimedes Screw. You'd probably want a small electric motor, though, because the wind won't always be blowing when you need it to.

 

[gloo]

You need to find the constant fill rate of the sump and buy the right pump I suggest varda pumps they are excellent very quite stainless in the important parts if you want a trickle flow get a pump with a low flow rate all the pump packs will have charts , but my suggestion would still be a high quality pump and float , moving parts precision counts you will get less noise and a power supply timer to regulate run times , believe it or not most of the bigger pumps make less noise then the budget pond pumps ,depending on size of sump get the required pump and float you will need to make a stepped well so float never sits lower than pump and I suggest go as.big as you can afford both price and fit and don't use hard PVC use hd poly ( blue line the fittings are push fit and absorb some movement also use pipe clamps on rubber bases these will help eliminate pipe chatter hope this helps : 4893633, member: 15808"]Yes, for a properly rated sump pump.

But he's talking about quiet little aquarium water pumps. What will be the flow rate for a 12 foot head?

Even pond pumps rarely have more than a 4-6 foot head. Imagine the power of a pond pump that can generate a fountain 12 feet high? (there are calculators for such things)

[/QUOTE]
thank you for your input Shannon H.

I think I have given up on the pond pump idea. I am going for a quiet sump pump and quiet check valve.

 

[gloo]

That seems like a really good idea: Archimedes Screw. You'd probably want a small electric motor, though, because the wind won't always be blowing when you need it to.

Too technical and not enough savvy and time on my part. If i had the time, I would look to ram a torpedo driller under the road to the other side of the ravine. But that isn't legal though.

 

[Danger]

I would look to ram a torpedo driller under the road to the other side of the ravine. But that isn't legal

Maybe you could hire a groundhog to do the dirty work for you, and plead ignorance to the deed.

 

[DaveC426913]

Maybe you could hire a groundhog to do the dirty work for you, and plead ignorance to the deed.

That's unrealistic. It will be very difficult to find a groundhog that can operate a torpedo driller.

 

[Danger]

:p
I was rather more thinking of having it use its claws...

 

[LeroyLaRey]

There's a water pump windmill called a BoJon that pumps air through a submerged tube. the air bubbles draw water up tube as they rise. Said to have limitations but is pretty reliable. 9 feet should be a cinch depending on ho much water you have to move & how fast. Try the aquarium air pump in a small tube.

 

[gloo]

There's a water pump windmill called a BoJon that pumps air through a submerged tube. the air bubbles draw water up tube as they rise. Said to have limitations but is pretty reliable. 9 feet should be a cinch depending on ho much water you have to move & how fast. Try the aquarium air pump in a small tube.

thx for suggestion

 

[gloo]

Yeah. This is where I was going.

Gonna be tricky to dampen a pump that's alternately submerged and emerged from water, as well as a lot of in-between.

So Dave, I have had this pond pump that I bought a few years ago and was afraid of it because it was not self priming and at the rating of 800 gph I was thinking i needed that special timer to turn it on for 5 min every 10 min etc..

turns out they have a built in constrictor, which regulates the flow...and it's quite flexible. But ever better yet, the higher my lift...the slower it gives in gph. At 13 feet, the the gph =0. Given that I am lifting about 12 feet...I think that can bring it to give or take 110 gph. Since my inflow rate is give or take 120, it should be interesting.

I will let you know how this thing goes. If this pond pump is quiet, it could be the next best solution (best being drilling under my road into the ravine :) )

Thanks and I will keep you posted.

 

[gloo]

I have found a range of external pumps (also known as inline) that have lifts as high as 18 feet. (course, it's 240V)There is a 110V pump with a 13.5' lift:

SUP02722 -1200-gph w/18' cord - 6.5 x 3 x 5.5 (Model 12)
110 watts; 1.5 amps. 880-gph @ 3'; 580-gph @ 10'; max lift 13.5'.

And it's magnetic, so it should be quiet.

http://www.thepondoutlet.com/home/tpo/page_2190_235/pondmaster_mag-drive_pumps.html

Open the 'Features' tab.

So I think this pond pump is the solution ...It's pretty quiet! and i can actually adjust the flow with the constrictor and the 12 foot lift slows it down quiet a bit. I think it can do 90 gph or 100 which would allow the sump to fill continuosly and the pond pump wont' pump dry. The company said it should work nicely for years and years...we will see about that.

All i need now is a timer that will turn it on 9 or 10 and turn back off at 6am.

 

[DaveC426913]

All i need now is a timer that will turn it on 9 or 10 and turn back off at 6am.

If that's all, a $9.99 timer from Wally-World will do.

 

[Travis_King]

For the sake of your foundation, and potentially the safety of your home/family, please ensure that your battery back-up or your full-sized pump are still set up with their floats in case the inflow becomes more than the pond pump can handle, your timer breaks, or it rains between 6 am and 10 pm...