Lowering Indices: Tensor Calculus Basics

Sure, but "low speed" requires a choice of frame; "speed" is relative. I was only pointing out that the implicit choice of frame being made is the rest frame of the fluid. I said it was a small nitpick. :wink:But I do think that pointing out the implicit frame choice is a good idea. It's easy to overlook things like that when you're reading something that's very familiar to you, but it can be confusing to someone who is just learning it.In summary, the conversation discusses the use of tensor calculus to derive the equation T_{00} = \rho c^2 in the low speed limit and assuming a time-independent source. This is achieved by setting \gamma and \mu to
  • #1
unscientific
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tensorlowering.png
At low speeds and assuming pressure ##P=0##,
[tex]T^{\alpha \beta} = \rho U^\alpha U^\beta [/tex]
[tex] g_{\alpha \mu} g_{\gamma \beta} T^{\alpha \beta} = \rho g_{\alpha \mu} g_{\gamma \beta} U^\alpha U^\beta [/tex]
[tex]T_{\gamma \mu} = \rho U_\mu U^\beta g_{\gamma \beta} [/tex]

Setting ##\gamma = \mu = 0##:

[tex] T_{00} = \rho U_0 U^\beta g_{0 \beta} [/tex]

Since ##g_{0 \beta} \backsimeq \eta_{0 \beta} ## and the only non-zero term is ##\eta_{00} = -1##, combined with ##U_\alpha U^\alpha = -c^2##:

[tex] T_{00} = \rho U_0 U^0 g_{00} = \rho c^2 [/tex]

I'm still learning tensor calculus, would that be considered a proper derivation?
Also, is ##g_{ij} \backsimeq \eta_{ij}## the reason why ##T_{ij} \backsimeq 0##?
 
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  • #2
unscientific said:
would that be considered a proper derivation?

It's correct as far as it goes, but you left out two things.

First: why do you assume ##P = 0##? The place you got this from only said a time-independent source at low speeds; it didn't say zero pressure. What eliminates the pressure terms?

Second: how do you know that ##U_0 U^0 = U_{\alpha} U^{\alpha}## for this case (which is what let's you substitute ##- c^2## for ##U_0 U^0##)? In general, ##U_{\alpha} U^{\alpha} = U_0 U^0 + U_1 U^1 + U_2 U^2 + U_3 U^3##. What eliminates the other three terms?

unscientific said:
is ##g_{ij} \backsimeq \eta_{ij}## the reason why ##T_{ij} \backsimeq 0##?

No. The correct reason is connected to the questions I asked above.
 
  • #3
PeterDonis said:
It's correct as far as it goes, but you left out two things.

First: why do you assume ##P = 0##? The place you got this from only said a time-independent source at low speeds; it didn't say zero pressure. What eliminates the pressure terms?

Second: how do you know that ##U_0 U^0 = U_{\alpha} U^{\alpha}## for this case (which is what let's you substitute ##- c^2## for ##U_0 U^0##)? In general, ##U_{\alpha} U^{\alpha} = U_0 U^0 + U_1 U^1 + U_2 U^2 + U_3 U^3##. What eliminates the other three terms?
No. The correct reason is connected to the questions I asked above.

Kinetic energy ##\propto k_BT## is much less than rest mass energy

[tex] P \backsimeq n k_B T << nMc^2 \backsimeq \rho c^2 [/tex]
So ##P \backsimeq 0##.

##U_\alpha U^\alpha = -c^2## because of invariance when you evalue ##U = (c,0)## in the rest frame.
 
  • #4
I also have a question, why do you take [itex]g_{\mu \nu} \approx \eta_{\mu \nu} [/itex]?
 
  • #5
ChrisVer said:
I also have a question, why do you take [itex]g_{\mu \nu} \approx \eta_{\mu \nu} [/itex]?

In the weak field limit of gravity, ## g_{\mu \nu} = \eta_{\mu \nu} + h_{\mu \nu} ## where ##|h_{\mu \nu} << 1##.
 
  • #6
aha, so you take the weak field limit...because I didn't see that in written in the text you attached. I would just say that in the low speed limit:
[itex] U^a = \begin{pmatrix} c \\ u_x \\ u_y \\ u_z \end{pmatrix} \approx c \begin{pmatrix} 1 \\ 0 \\ 0 \\ 0 \end{pmatrix} [/itex]
and this gives immediately the components of [itex]T^{ab}[/itex]
 
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  • #7
unscientific said:
Kinetic energy ##\propto k_BT## is much less than rest mass energy

Not in all cases. I was asking what makes it true in this case.

unscientific said:
##U_\alpha U^\alpha = -c^2## because of invariance

I wasn't asking why ##U_\alpha U^\alpha = -c^2##. I was asking why ##U_0 U^0 = - c^2##, i.e., why ##U_0 U^0 = U_\alpha U^\alpha##. I think ChrisVer gave the answer to that, though.

ChrisVer said:
I would just say that in the low speed limit

Small nitpick: in the low speed limit, and in the rest frame of the fluid...
 
  • #8
PeterDonis said:
Small nitpick: in the low speed limit, and in the rest frame of the fluid...

wouldn't you agree that in the low speed limit this approximation holds (I just used [itex]u_i/c \approx 0[/itex])? The thing is that the text says "taking the low speed limit" (together with time independence of the source)
 
  • #9
ChrisVer said:
wouldn't you agree that in the low speed limit this approximation holds

Sure, but "low speed" requires a choice of frame; "speed" is relative. I was only pointing out that the implicit choice of frame being made is the rest frame of the fluid. I said it was a small nitpick. :wink:
 

Related to Lowering Indices: Tensor Calculus Basics

1. What are tensors in tensor calculus?

In tensor calculus, tensors are mathematical objects that describe the relationships between vectors, scalars, and other tensors. They are represented as multi-dimensional arrays of numbers and can be used to perform calculations in physics, engineering, and other fields.

2. What does lowering an index mean in tensor calculus?

Lowering an index in tensor calculus refers to the process of converting a tensor with a covariant index into a tensor with a contravariant index. This is done by multiplying the tensor by the metric tensor, which is a mathematical object that describes the curvature of a space.

3. Why is lowering indices important in tensor calculus?

Lowering indices is important in tensor calculus because it allows for the manipulation and transformation of tensors to be performed more easily. By converting tensors to have the same type of index, calculations can be simplified and equations can be written in a more compact form.

4. What are some applications of tensor calculus?

Tensor calculus has many applications in physics and engineering, including general relativity, fluid mechanics, electromagnetism, and quantum mechanics. It is also used in computer graphics and machine learning for tasks such as image recognition and natural language processing.

5. How can I learn more about lowering indices in tensor calculus?

There are many resources available for learning about lowering indices in tensor calculus, including textbooks, online lectures, and tutorials. It is important to have a strong foundation in linear algebra and calculus before diving into tensor calculus. Practice problems and hands-on experience with software such as Mathematica or Python can also be helpful in understanding this concept.

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