Hubble's Law and Doppler Shift

In summary, the conversation discusses the distance and observability of a galaxy with a speed of ##c## and a hypothetical galaxy with a speed of 1.1c. The first part concludes that the galaxy would be observable from Earth, but the answers in the back of the book suggest otherwise. The second part discusses the concept of the Hubble limit and how it affects the observability of objects in the universe. It is noted that light emitted by objects outside the Hubble limit would never be seen by an observer on Earth. The person is unsure of how to approach the second part without accounting for the Doppler Effect.
  • #1
PhDeezNutz
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Homework Statement
According to Hubble's Law, the distant galaxies are receding from us speeds proportional to their distance from us;

$$v \left( r \right) = \alpha r$$

Where ##\alpha = 2.18 \cdot 10^{-18} \text{ sec}^{-1}##

(a) How far would a galaxy be whose speed with respect to the Earth is ##c##? Would it be observable from the Earth?

(b) Consider the same questions (including Doppler Effect) for a hypothetical galaxy for which ##v(r) = 1.1c##
Relevant Equations
$$v \left( r \right) = \alpha r$$

Where ##\alpha = 2.18 \cdot 10^{-18} \text{ sec}^{-1}##

$$1 \text{ lightyear} = 9.4608 \cdot 10^{15} \text{ m }$$

According to wikipedia the observable universe has a radius of ##4.65 \cdot 10^{10} \text{ lightyears}##
(a) How far would a galaxy be whose speed with respect to the Earth is ##c##? Would it be observable from the Earth?

r=rα=1.5⋅1026 m =1.6⋅1010 lightyears<4.65⋅1010 lightyearsr=rα=1.5⋅1026 m =1.6⋅1010 lightyears<4.65⋅1010 lightyearsr=rα=1.5⋅1026 m =1.6⋅1010 lightyears<4.65⋅1010 lightyears
r=ca=1.5⋅1026 m=1.6⋅1010 lightyears<4.65⋅1010lightyearsr=ca=1.5⋅1026 m=1.6⋅1010 lightyears<4.65⋅1010lightyears​
So Yes, the galaxy would be visible from the Earth. That said, the answers in the back of the book indicate that it is not (correct answer: No). That also said, my numerical answer for part (a) is correct according to the back of the book. Is it possible that the observable universe was smaller in 1968 when the book was published? I can't find what it was in 1968? Or is the method used/referenced in wiki different than the one under consideration?

(b) Consider the same questions (including Doppler Effect) for a hypothetical galaxy for which ##v(r) = 1.1c##

I honestly don't know how to do this apart accounting for Doppler Effect but here's what I get without accounting for Doppler Effect (using the approach from part(a)). There's no mention of wavelength or frequency so I don't understand how the Doppler Effect has anything to do with it.

r=1.1cα≈1.5⋅1026 m=1.6⋅1010 lightyears<4.65⋅1010 lightyearsr=1.1cα≈1.5⋅1026 m=1.6⋅1010 lightyears<4.65⋅1010 lightyears​
I'm lost. I don't even understand the premise of part(b).

Edit: I'm going to Latex it up and take pictures and post it because the latex on the forum seems to be messing up.

Image 5-1-20 at 3.31 PM.jpg
 
Last edited:
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  • #2
Hi,

There are two different concepts: the Universe, and the observable universe ( a part of the Universe ).

In a universe with constant Hubble parameter, light emitted at the present time by objects outside the Hubble limit would never be seen by an observer on Earth.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hubble_volume

I hope it clarifies a bit.

Regards,
ORF
 
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Likes PhDeezNutz

1. What is Hubble's Law?

Hubble's Law is a fundamental principle in astronomy that describes the relationship between the distance of a galaxy from Earth and its velocity. It states that the farther away a galaxy is, the faster it is moving away from us.

2. How does Hubble's Law relate to the expansion of the universe?

Hubble's Law is evidence for the expansion of the universe. The fact that galaxies farther away from us are moving away faster suggests that the universe is expanding uniformly in all directions.

3. What is the Doppler effect and how does it relate to Hubble's Law?

The Doppler effect is the change in frequency of a wave (such as light or sound) due to the relative motion between the source and the observer. In the case of light from distant galaxies, the Doppler effect causes a shift in the wavelength of light, known as the redshift, which is used to measure the velocity of the galaxy and determine its distance from Earth.

4. How is Hubble's Law used to measure the age of the universe?

By measuring the velocities and distances of galaxies using Hubble's Law, scientists can calculate the age of the universe. This is done by using the inverse of Hubble's constant, which represents the rate of expansion of the universe, to determine how long it would take for all galaxies to have been in the same location in the past.

5. Are there any limitations to Hubble's Law and the use of Doppler shift in measuring distances to galaxies?

Yes, there are limitations to Hubble's Law and the use of Doppler shift. One limitation is that it assumes a linear relationship between distance and velocity, but this may not hold true for very distant galaxies or those in regions with strong gravitational influences. Additionally, the Doppler shift may be affected by other factors such as the rotation of galaxies or the presence of dark matter. Scientists continue to refine and improve these methods to account for these limitations.

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