- #36
gneill
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chawki said:so the weight of the balloon is simply 10.5*9.81=103.005 N ?
Yes, that is the weight of the balloon and the gas inside it if the buoyancy is ignored.
chawki said:so the weight of the balloon is simply 10.5*9.81=103.005 N ?
gneill said:Yes, that is the weight of the balloon and the gas inside it if the buoyancy is ignored.
gneill said:Yes.
You know, I think we went through all this before...
gneill said:The buoyant force is the equal to the weight of the displaced air. Period.
The lift force is equal to the buoyant force minus the weight of the materials making up the balloon -- that is, it is the force available for lifting cargo (you don't count the balloon as cargo).
chawki said:ok. so Fb=weight of the materials making up the balloon + weight of cargo ?
but what is the weight of the materials making up the balloon here
gneill said:the buoyant force is the equal to the weight of the displaced air. Nothing else. It's the upward force due to the displacement of the air. It does not include any other forces (like weights, loads, other external forces).
chawki said:... ... ...
chawki said:i think we are always supposed to calculate the buoyant force, and if:
the buoyant force = weight of displaced fluid-weight of the objcet
and if:
the buoyant force is = the weight of the displaced air
HOW CAN THESE EQUATIONS BE SAME?
gneill said:Forces of interest:
1. Weight of balloon
2. Buoyant force
3. Weight of cargo
The lift is what remains of the buoyant force when the weight of the balloon is subtracted... it's the force available to lift the cargo. In this case it's equal to the weight of the cargo, since the problem specifies the maximum cargo.
Note that the balloon will not be able to rise with its cargo because there's no unbalanced lift force left over to provide for acceleration. This is a condition referred to as "neutral buoyancy", where an object will neither sink nor rise.
gneill said:Yes. That is the equation that describes the situation put forth in the problem statement. So you should be able to solve for the weight of the cargo, right?
chawki said:i found that by applying second law of Newton at a statioanary state...
but you didn't answer what i asked in post#43
gneill said:What did you ask? You said:
"in post#23 you said the buoyant force is 231.51 N
isn't 128.505 N ?"
That question is answered! The buoyant force is 231.51 N, the weight of the displaced air.
It is not 128.505 N, the weight of the displaced air minus the weight of the balloon; that is the lift.
I cannot see how to make it any clearer. The only forces of interest are the buoyant force, the weight of the balloon, the lift (buoyancy - weight of balloon), and the weight of the cargo (which is set equal in magnitude to the lift for this problem).