Exploring Wonky Science: A Quest for Answers

[tejolson]

I think I received some wonky science, I need you folks to correct me. I'm going to try very hard to make this work. In fact I'm going to try so hard that I'm going to make up science as I go. I'll let you smart people figure out where I went wrong.

So the basic idea is a 60' pipe going at an incline (maybe 6 ft difference of elevation) with a fan exhausting the air at the top. I'm told the air that comes out is dryer and colder than the air that comes in. The reason it is dryer is because the air drops the water as it climbs the pipe. I'm thinking about the excessive rains in the mountains where the sky crashes into the earth. So a gas is becoming a liquid, that is condensation which is cooling. Which is in line with what is going on. If this is happening, then the water falls and air is just going to pick it up and vaporize it causing heat. Gravity is moving the liquid state backwards creating a current and spreading the liquid for further vaporization. It keeps picking it up and dropping it until it gets to the bottom. I think I read somewhere that air gets denser as it has less moisture content. This would make a tiny vacuum. It seems to me that there is a tug of war going on here, but I guess gravity and the expansion property of gas wins out in the end. So, the heat is at the bottom where it began, the absence of heat is at the top. The moisture content is on the bottom as a liquid. The air at the top, without it's moisture content, is denser than the bottom.

So... Water climbs all the time, it's how we get rain. This seems to collide with that aspect. It seems to me that I'm saying water is incapable of climbing, which clearly isn't true.

I have more to say on the topic (static electricity, oxygen burning, sonoluminescence, separating other gasses, optimizations), but I'll wait until I'm corrected before I take this any further.

 

[davenn]

hi there tejolson
welcome to PF :)

There's so many woo woo comments in you post that I hardly know where to start

I think I received some wonky science, I need you folks to correct me. I'm going to try very hard to make this work. In fact I'm going to try so hard that I'm going to make up science as I go. I'll let you smart people figure out where I went wrong.

So the basic idea is a 60' pipe going at an incline (maybe 6 ft difference of elevation) with a fan exhausting the air at the top. I'm told the air that comes out is dryer and colder than the air that comes in. The reason it is dryer is because the air drops the water as it climbs the pipe. .

Cant answer that, but if it is fact, I suspect the difference over 6ft probably won't be measureable
with easily accessible test equipment

I'm thinking about the excessive rains in the mountains where the sky crashes into the earth. So a gas is becoming a liquid, that is condensation which is cooling. Which is in line with what is going on..

the sky doesn't crash into anything ...
have a look at this wiki page to mainly explain rain in mountains

If this is happening, then the water falls and air is just going to pick it up and vaporize it causing heat. Gravity is moving the liquid state backwards creating a current and spreading the liquid for further vaporization. It keeps picking it up and dropping it until it gets to the bottom. I think I read somewhere that air gets denser as it has less moisture content. This would make a tiny vacuum. It seems to me that there is a tug of war going on here, but I guess gravity and the expansion property of gas wins out in the end. So, the heat is at the bottom where it began, the absence of heat is at the top. The moisture content is on the bottom as a liquid. The air at the top, without it's moisture content, is denser than the bottom.
So... Water climbs all the time, it's how we get rain. This seems to collide with that aspect. It seems to me that I'm saying water is incapable of climbing, which clearly isn't true.

google Water cycle to get your information straight on that last block of comments
look at the diagrams that are shown for the water cycle and how it occurrs

I have more to say on the topic (static electricity, oxygen burning, sonoluminescence, separating other gasses, optimizations), but I'll wait until I'm corrected before I take this any further.

that will be interesting ;)

cheers
Dave

 

[Baluncore]

It would be a mistake to answer your question by pointing out your false assumptions and paralogical reasoning. That would be unproductive.

To reason in this field requires an understanding of the concepts of thermodynamics along with the precise use of the associated terminology. It is simply not possible to reason in this field in a human language, as you have demonstrated so well here.

Thermodynamics is the simplest rational explanation of what is happening. It is better to study the simplest science that is known to work than it is to rely on guesswork and wishful thinking. If you are going to work in this field then you must first study the fascinating science of thermodynamics until you are able to describe and analyse your physical model in thermodynamic terms.

Otherwise, it is not science, it is not even wonky science, it is just wonky thinking.

 

[Baluncore]

Tejolson, you are interested and enthusiastic. If I could grant you one thing that would empower you now, it would be an understanding of thermodynamics. You could then reason and communicate your ideas clearly with others in the field.

Unfortunately I cannot give you that understanding, I can only encourage you to search for it. If you can apply your interest and enthusiasm to study, then you will soon look back and be amazed at the power and confidence you have gained by taking a few small steps.

The challenge is not in the study, it is in the realisation that you must take a first step to begin your exploration of a fascinating field. The problem is really that, from where you are now, you cannot see that greater field. All I can do is assure you that the grass really is greener on this side of the fence.

Does Tejolson now jump the fence, or just continue to wander alone in the wilderness ?
Only time will tell.

Welcome to thermodynamics.

 

[pmacias]

Hello,

Thank you for sharing your thoughts and ideas on this topic. I can understand your curiosity and desire to explore and understand the phenomenon you have described. However, I must point out that some of the concepts and explanations you have presented are not scientifically accurate.

Firstly, the idea that air becomes denser as it has less moisture content is not correct. In fact, dry air is less dense than moist air due to the presence of water vapor molecules. This is why humid air feels heavier and can also affect atmospheric pressure.

Secondly, the concept of a gas turning into a liquid due to gravity is not accurate. While gravity does play a role in the water cycle and the formation of rain, it is not the sole factor. Temperature, pressure, and other atmospheric conditions also play a significant role.

Furthermore, the idea that air is picking up and vaporizing the water as it falls is not entirely correct. Water molecules in the air do not simply disappear or turn into gas, they undergo a process called evaporation which requires energy (heat) to occur. So, the air at the top of the pipe would not necessarily become colder as it loses moisture.

Lastly, I would caution against making up science as you go and trying to fit your ideas into pre-existing concepts. It is important to base your ideas and theories on scientific evidence and research, and to always be open to correction and new information.

I encourage you to continue exploring and learning about science, but to also be mindful of the accuracy and validity of your ideas. Thank you for your contribution to the discussion.