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zk4586
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I'm curious as to why the postmodernist movement and postmodern ideas have not only been rejected but have been downright vilified by so many academicians, what are your opinions?
Among postmodernism's positive achievements has been to highlight issues of gender, race and ethnicity as well as placing questions of sexuality, desire and identity firmly on the political agenda. Marxism has dealt tolerably well with the first set of issues but less well withthe latter. Postmodernism can at least be credited with "an immeasurable deepening of the fleshless, anaemic, tight-lipped politics of an earlier era."
Originally posted by N_Quire
Fundamentalists and scientific rationlists are hooked on the idea of absolutes as in Absolute Truth, final answers, objectivity. Post-modernism has done some good sniping attacks on those concepts, seeing truth not as absolute but as something upon which there is consense or agreement. It's relative. The fundies, religious and scientific, hate relativism.
Exactly ! And even more refining that differenceOriginally posted by Tiberius
There's a crucial difference between
fundamentalist and scientific rationalists
you're missing N_Quire.
Saying that there IS an objective truth is
not the same as saying "I KNOW" what that
objective truth IS.
Originally posted by wuliheron
I think this touches on the core reason why post modernists are vilified so much without spelling it out in plain english. It is a reactionary movement to the conservative mainstream and such movements knowingly and willingly present themselves as targets to be vilified. Considering zk4586 defense of postmodernism, I have to wonder if this is also the point of this thread. :0)
Originally posted by zk4586
you always seem to take portions of what I say without actually looking at the whole thing. If you know anything about the Enlightenment then you know that it was concerned with explaining everything in scientific, ie rational, terms. Not just the motion of the planets, and other astronomical and physical phenomena, but social systems, human actions and thought processes, et cetera. In the latter respect, it has failed.
Originally posted by Tiberius
Yes, I know what you mean ZK, and I still disagree. You mentioned "social systems, human actions and thought processes, et cetera" so I'll address those...
SOCIAL SYSTEMS:
The scientific method has had a profound impact on the study of social systems, even giving rise to the field of sociology itself. An enormous amount of data has been gleaned about social systems including economic theories, political theories, trend analysis, polling methods, and so on. Complex systems theory is also touching on the dynamics of social systems in never before seen ways and I think we're making good progress here. Not quite a failure.
HUMAN ACTIONS:
Are you denying the entire field of psychology? I think we know a hell of a lot more now about human behavior then we did before the enlightenment. Also not a failure by any stretch of the imagination.
HUMAN THOUGHT PROCESSES:
There are literally thousands of books now on the subject, describing how brains function, process information, memory, emotion, instinct, and consciousness. This knowledge has lead to effective surgeries and treatments for brain injuries, as well as interfaces for paralyzed people. And to anyone not preoccupied with mystical conceptions, these models provide accurate and satisfying descriptions of how and why the brain works as it does. Are they complete in every detail? No, but comprehensively the data on this is huge and growing daily - hardly a failure.
The only people who think that things aren't currently or can't be described scientifically are those who have some sort of predetermined insistance that there "must" be something more (or less in the case of postmodernists), due to cultural ideology or psychological needs. More commonly, it's simply a matter of wanting to pretend they can know as much about the questions of the universe as a physicist, neurosurgeon, or biologist without actually putting in the work and effort to learn about all of the tremendous successes in every field that the enlightenment has brought.
I'm curious as to why the postmodernist movement and postmodern ideas have not only been rejected but have been downright vilified by so many academicians, what are your opinions?
It seems to me from reading postmodernist writings that the defining theme of postmodernism is its radical skepticism. It seems like an obvious backlash to the globalization and scientizing that has occurred in the past 100 years, but not something that should be outrightly dismissed. I personally feel that the deconstructionist school of literary criticism has a lot of strong points and arguments that have, unfortunately, been passed over or rejected because it became caught up in the larger political and social issues that postmodernism has confronted.
Postmodernism is a philosophical and cultural movement that emerged in the late 20th century. It is characterized by a rejection of traditional norms and values, a skepticism towards universal truths, and an emphasis on subjectivity and individual experience. It is often vilified because it challenges traditional beliefs and institutions, leading to criticisms of being chaotic or nihilistic.
Modernism is a movement that emerged in the late 19th century and is characterized by a focus on rationality, progress, and universal truths. Postmodernism, on the other hand, emerged in the late 20th century and rejects these ideas, instead emphasizing subjectivity, individualism, and a skepticism towards universal truths. Postmodernism is often seen as a reaction against the ideals of modernism.
Some people view postmodernism as a threat because it challenges traditional beliefs and institutions, which can be seen as destabilizing and chaotic. Postmodernism also questions the notion of objective truth, which can be seen as a threat to established power structures and ideologies.
Some of the main criticisms of postmodernism include its rejection of universal truths, its emphasis on subjectivity and individual experience, and its perceived lack of a coherent ideology. Critics also argue that postmodernism can lead to relativism and a disregard for objective reality.
Postmodernism has influenced society in various ways, including in art, literature, architecture, and popular culture. Its emphasis on individual experience and subjectivity has led to a greater appreciation for diverse perspectives and marginalized voices. However, it has also been criticized for contributing to a sense of cultural relativism and a disregard for objective truth.