50th anniversary of Playboy Magazine

  • News
  • Thread starter JOEBIALEK
  • Start date
In summary, pornography is a form of sexually explicit material that is intended to cause sexual arousal. It is often justified by those who promote it as a form of free speech, protected by the First Amendment of the United States Constitution. However, there are moral and ethical concerns surrounding the production and consumption of pornography, as it portrays sex as a means to an end rather than an expression of love between consenting adults. Despite its controversial nature, pornography continues to be a popular form of sexual stimulation for many individuals. Ultimately, the root of the problem lies in society's obsession with sex, which can have negative consequences. Until there is a shift in this mindset, the issue of pornography will continue to be a topic of debate.
  • #1
JOEBIALEK
On this 50th anniversary of Playboy Magazine, perhaps a discussion of pornography is appropriate. Pornography is defined as
sexually explicit pictures, writing, or other material whose primary purpose is to cause sexual arousal. Those who promote it believe they are exercising their right from the first amendment of the United States Constitution:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

The delicate question before us goes beyond the legal justification for allowing anyone to speak or write about anything they choose to. It speaks to the moral and ethical ramifications of such an enterprise. Our society today is inundated with references to sexuality in any medium we experience. The often quoted justification is that "sex sells" and therefore if marketing outlets can somehow equate a material purchase with sexual gratification, then some hidden unmet need will be satisfied. This is Freudianomics at its worst. Sex is promoted today as a means to an end and not the expression of love between consenting adults. Pornography portrays sex as some lustful hedonism with little regard for the potential outcome of such an experience. Still, millions of people purchase it for their own sexual stimulation. They believe that since those being filmed are consenting adults there is no harm to anyone. Assuming there is mutual consent among the actors, what is the difference between paying them to have sex with each other and paying a prostitute to have sex with you? Whether you favor or oppose pornography, it is this country's obsession with sex that is the root of the problem and the unfortunate consequences it produces. Until we as a nation can collectively mature out of this sexual pre-occupation we will be trapped in our own national adolescence.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
  • #2
Step off the soapbox. You seem to have a lot of emotional and moral dilemmas to deal with. You imply that you feel pornography is harmful. Who is harmed by it? Everyone, including the consumer, is a willing participant.

Last I checked, every television and computer sold in the world comes equipped with an "OFF" button. If you don't like sex on TV, or sex on the internet, then make liberal use of that button.

Besides, if you really think AMERICA is obsessed with sex, I recommend you spend some time in a European society to get a sense of perspective. America stills holds a number of wacky puritanical beliefs not shared by many other cultures. If you think sex is dirty and evil, you're in just about the best place you can be.

- Warren
 
  • #3
I think I'm quoting someone. "Does it really matter what those people do as long as they don’t do it in the streets and frighten the children!"
 
  • #4
I think America is obsessed with sex because it is repressed. If the 'morality police' would leave it alone, and people would not make it something to be ashamed of, there wouldn't be such a fixation on it. When it stops being 'dirty', I guarantee it would stop being such a big deal.
 
  • #5
Yes, Zero, that must be exactly why Europe, in its progressive wisdom, is so open about sex that birth control is handed out to minors, even though the stats of sexually active teenagers in Europe is far higher than in America.
 
  • #6
Originally posted by Jonathan
Yes, Zero, that must be exactly why Europe, in its progressive wisdom, is so open about sex that birth control is handed out to minors, even though the stats of sexually active teenagers in Europe is far higher than in America.
Stats, please? Teenagers in America are having lots of sex, in case you haven't checked. I think the kids that are able to find a partner are having sex everywhere worldwide. Are they getting pregnant more often in Europe? Are they getting more STDs?

Most importantly, taking away birth control doesn't stop people from having sex. It hasn't worked in America, certainly.
 
  • #7
coming from a female, i see absolutely nothing wrong with pornography as it is in america...it is managed for adults over 18, no violence comes from it, and it is safe...if any sort of "media" needs to be monitored, it is the garbage information that everyone has access to on television...
 
  • #8
Originally posted by Zero
Are they getting pregnant more often in Europe?
Believe me, there are more teenage moms in the US than in Europe..
 
  • #9
Originally posted by Monique
Believe me, there are more teenage moms in the US than in Europe..
Do you have any stats on that? All I know is, if kids have access to birth control, they may or may not have more sex, but they certainly won't get pregnant as often.

I think in America, the push to stop people from having sex causes some folks to ignore or downplay the issues of STDs and unwanted pregnancy. Instead of talking about condoms and birth control, they say 'if you don't have sex, it won't happen'...which is true, but unrealistic. in the real world, people have sex, and it is better to accept it and work on pragmatic solutions, rather than live in a fantasy land where everyone is asexual.
 
  • #10
"When we repress our sexuality, we undercut the foundation of human and society."

-Hugh Hefner
 
  • #11
kerrie, porn on the net and sometimes tv too is very easy for minors to get, and sometimes it does come with violence
Zero, I get the impression that Monique was agreeing with you. Also, have you ever noticed that if you make a stat claim, I never ask you for the study, I just use some real world simple logic to prove you made it up and don't even realize it? But I'll see if I can find it just to humor you...Also, I notice that you didn't ask choot for stats, even though he posted almost the same thing, and it was only the second post in the thread, third parargraph
Besides, if you really think AMERICA is obsessed with sex, I recommend you spend some time in a European society to get a sense of perspective. America stills holds a number of wacky puritanical beliefs not shared by many other cultures. If you think sex is dirty and evil, you're in just about the best place you can be.
The only differences is that he didn't use the word 'stats' and I disagree with one part, unless you call having a Playboy on the shelf at every other 7-11 puritanical.
The_Professional, yes, I'm sure that is a completely unbaised quote.
 
  • #12
Well, I've tried for half an hour and found very little. However, I did find one source that said that the age of first sexual intercouse is: US15.8, Nether17.7, German16.2, France16.8. However, I remember what I heard, but not who or exactly when or exactly what numbers, but that is not what I heard. Anyway, their numbers seem to be very recent, but they are also of the rediculus opinion that teenagers have a right to privacy that includes a right to sex, so I can't be sure of these numbers, esp. as they cite no source.
Well, regardless of the truth of these numbers, I'm still of the opinion that all those average teenagers in those countries probably didn't wait long enough. There is one major indicator in my mind of when it has been long enough: do you still live with mom and dad? If yes, then no.
 
  • #13
Jonathan, I know Monique was agreeing with me, I was asking her for stats for the same reason I asked you for stats. I haven't made anything up, I clearly stated in at least one post that I was basically guessing based on what I know, and on common sense.

America DOES have some wacky puritanical beliefs, silly people that we are. People afraid of dirty words, nipples, genitals, ect.
 
  • #14
Oh, I'm sorry, I misunderstood what you wrote. However, I stand by my other two comments:
(I disagree with Zero)...unless you call having a Playboy on the shelf at every other 7-11 puritanical.
and
There is one major indicator in my mind of when it has been long enough: do you still live with mom and dad? If yes, then no.
 
  • #15
http://www.advocatesforyouth.org/publications/factsheet/fsest.htm

In the United States, the teen pregnancy rate is more than nine times higher than that in the Netherlands, nearly four times higher than the rate in France, and nearly five times higher than that in Germany
In the United States, the teen birth rate is nearly 11 times higher than that of the Netherlands, nearly five times higher than the rate in France, and nearly four times higher than that in Germany
In the United States, the teen abortion rate is nearly eight times higher than the rate in Germany, nearly seven times higher than that in the Netherlands, and nearly three times higher than the rate in France
In the United States, the estimated HIV prevalence rate in young men ages 15 to 24 is over five times higher than the rate in Germany, nearly three times higher than the rate in the Netherlands, and about 1 ½ times higher than that in France
In the United States, young people typically initiate sexual intercourse at the same age or even earlier compared to young people in the Netherlands and France

And on and on and on...

I'm with Zero on this one (Surprise!:wink: ) Our society, in the U.S., is puritannical...sexuality is supresssed..particularly for women..thank god that's changing...slowly...Probably the easiest way to measure how suppressed our society is are the many books and programs that are now being promoted to help parents talk about...the difficult...and embarrassing...subject of S.E.X. with their teens...When those books and programs are no longer so neccesary...and the neccessity is not so..widespread and HUGE..then I think one could say we are not repressed.
 
  • #16
Originally posted by Jonathan
. There is one major indicator in my mind of when it has been long enough: do you still live with mom and dad? If yes, then no.
Lol, sorry..but I think this would be a ridiculous indicator...particularly when you consider multi generaton households and "children" who are living and sometimes caring for their parents...well into adulthood.
I think a better indicator would be...do you have the physical, mental, emotional maturity and financial security to care for a child or manage an abortion if your having intercourse brings one forth, as well as "do you have the personal maturity to be responsible enough to always use birth control?" and for health reasons..a condom?
 
  • #17
Originally posted by Jonathan
Well, I've tried for half an hour and found very little. However, I did find one source that said that the age of first sexual intercouse is: US 15.8, Nether 17.7, German 16.2, France 16.8.
Are those numbers for boys or girls? Girls have sex at a much younger age than boys do.. maybe 2-3 years difference.
 
  • #18
Originally posted by Monique
Are those numbers for boys or girls? Girls have sex at a much younger age than boys do.. maybe 2-3 years difference.

Did you mean "reach puberty" instead of "have sex"? Girls in the US at least report much less sex than boys, and even allowing for the differential rewards to the sexes of bragging/hiding, sociologists believe that to be so. And I thought I saw somewhere that girls have first intercourse a year or so after the boya - in the US.
 
  • #19
From: http://www.cdc.gov/reproductivehealth/datoact/pdf/adhlth2.pdf [Broken]
To gain some perspective on the public health importance of pregnancy among adolescents in the United States, we must evaluate the problem in a world context. In a 1985 study of pregnancy among teenagers in the United States and Western Europe, investigators found that although teenage fertility rates declined in both the United States and Western Europe in the early 1980s, the United States still had teenage pregnancy and birthrates considerably higher than rates in Canada, England, Wales, France, the Netherlands, and Sweden (9). Although U.S. rates of sexual activity were not dramatically different from rates in these countries, the effective use of contraceptives and access to contraceptive and abortion services differed considerably (9).

From: http://www.marchofdimes.com/professionals/681_1159.asp
Teenage birth rates in this country have declined steadily since 1991. While this is good news, teen birth rates in the U.S. remain high, exceeding those in most developed countries.6
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #20
Originally posted by selfAdjoint
Did you mean "reach puberty" instead of "have sex"? Girls in the US at least report much less sex than boys, and even allowing for the differential rewards to the sexes of bragging/hiding, sociologists believe that to be so. And I thought I saw somewhere that girls have first intercourse a year or so after the boya - in the US.
It was a newsitem about a week ago where are sexuologist was interviewed and came with the data.

Do you really believe boys are having sex before girls? Can you imagine a 15 year old boy have sex with a 17 year old girl? No, but it DOES work the other way around. The truth is that girls reach sexual and emotional maturity earlier than boys..

The results DID surprise me at first though, but giving it a little thought it seems logical.. I know some guys who are 23/25 and haven't outgrown puberty :wink:
 
  • #21
Originally posted by Monique
It was a newsitem about a week ago where are sexuologist was interviewed and came with the data.

Do you really believe boys are having sex before girls? Can you imagine a 15 year old boy have sex with a 17 year old girl? No, but it DOES work the other way around. The truth is that girls reach sexual and emotional maturity earlier than boys..

The results DID surprise me at first though, but giving it a little thought it seems logical.. I know some guys who are 23/25 and haven't outgrown puberty :wink:

The Alan Guttmacher institute has numerous comprehensive sexual and reproductive studies
This one would disagree with what you;ve stated here
http://www.agi-usa.org/pubs/fb_10-02.html
Sexual Activity


• Men experience first intercouse at 16.9, on average, and women at 17.4. Men spend slightly longer being sexually active before getting married: nearly 10 years, on average, compared with just under 8 years for women. 1

• By their late teenage years, at least 3/4 of all men and women have had intercourse, and more than 2/3 of all sexually experienced teens have had 2 or more partners.2

• Among sexually experienced people in their 20s, 31% of men and 20% of women had more than one sexual partner in the past year. 3

• In their 30s and 40s, when the great majority of men and women are married, most have only one sexual partner in a given year. 4
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #22
jonathan...yes, porn is easy to get to on the web for those curious hormone raging teenage boys...it is also easy for them to raid their dad's playboy collection too...i have a 4 year old son...if and when i find a porn magazine in his room at 16, i am not going to fret...it's absolutely normal and this country makes such a big deal about something harmless...there is no crime for looking at porn, it is a moral issue of the individual, not of the masses...

as far as higher teen pregnancy in europe, is it perhaps teens in america have better access to abortions? is planned parenthood in europe?
 
  • #23
Originally posted by Kerrie

as far as higher teen pregnancy in europe, is it perhaps teens in america have better access to abortions? is planned parenthood in europe?

Kerrie, I believe if you check my quotes above you will see that in the U.S. there are far more pregnancies...as well as far more abortions...If you click my first link...you can see more stats as well as graphs..http://www.advocatesforyouth.org/publications/factsheet/fsest.htm

I feel pretty confidant on my knowledge in this area as..I'm currently parenting 5 children (4 are mine) ages 11, 12, 17, 18, and 20 :wink: I assure you knowledge of puberty, teen sexuality and risks..are at the top of my priority list...
 
Last edited:
  • #24
I agree with Monique on this one at least in Western-Europe, I can not speak for the US. It is a fact that girls have sex earlier than boys with an interval of about two years. If you would do a poll in a random Belgian school about this, you would most certainly get these results. As a matter of fact, I believe some time ago there has been one in Belgium. It stated that at the age of 16 about half of the girls have lost their virginity. Boys in general take about two years longer. I do not have the exact numbers though, it is just something I have recently read somewhere.
 
  • #25
Originally posted by kat
Kerrie, I believe if you check my quotes above you will see that in the U.S. there are far more pregnancies...as well as far more abortions...If you click my first link...you can see more stats as well as graphs..http://www.advocatesforyouth.org/publications/factsheet/fsest.htm
The Netherlands comes out really good in your link :)
 
  • #26
How old are all you guys? don't mean to be rude or anything, was just curious as too how many teenagers are actually taking part in this thread.

I am 18 and i know that a lot of the girls that i knew at secondary school had lost their virginity by the time they where 15-16 most of which where to guys who where a few years older than them.
 
  • #27
Originally posted by kat
Kerrie, I believe if you check my quotes above you will see that in the U.S. there are far more pregnancies...as well as far more abortions...If you click my first link...you can see more stats as well as graphs..http://www.advocatesforyouth.org/publications/factsheet/fsest.htm

I feel pretty confidant on my knowledge in this area as..I'm currently parenting 5 children (4 are mine) ages 11, 12, 17, 18, and 20 :wink: I assure you knowledge of puberty, teen sexuality and risks..are at the top of my priority list...

thanks for the link kat...typically i don't check links because i feel the internet's reliability is about as good as the television, and many people throw out links as evidence because the information on the links back up what they are trying to sell to others...it would seem the link you provided is credible however...but it does prove monique's point:

Believe me, there are more teenage moms in the US than in Europe..

yes, a higher rate of teen pregnancy in the united states, "cancelled" out by the high number of abortions...her point was teenage mothers are abundant in europe (or at least in the netherlands)...

and zero, she would have the best form of proof by living in europe and seeing it for herself (sometimes better proof over "stats")...much closer then you and i...
 
  • #28
Originally posted by Kerrie
thanks for the link kat...typically i don't check links because i feel the internet's reliability is about as good as the television, and many people throw out links as evidence because the information on the links back up what they are trying to sell to others...it would seem the link you provided is credible however...but it does prove monique's point:
I try to give factual and dependable sources in my links. On this particular topic, I feel strongly about knowing the truth as opposed to supporting some view that I hold..the impact it can have on our children is far to great to argue it to prove a point.



yes, a higher rate of teen pregnancy in the united states, "cancelled" out by the high number of abortions...
No, I think that not only is there a higher rate of teen pregnancy..but also a higher rate of births...and a higher rate of abortion in the United States. The Alan Guttmacher Institute did a very large and comprehensive study of many developed countries their study can be accessed here:http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/euroteen_or.html [Broken] If you glance through the executive summary you will find this statement:
U.S. teenagers have higher birthrates
than adolescents in the other study
countries because they are much more
likely to become pregnant, and because
those who become pregnant are less
likely than pregnant adolescents in the
other countries to have abortions
(Chart 2). At the same time, however,
U.S. teenagers also have a higher abortion
rate than their peers in the other
countries because they are more likely
to become pregnant unintentionally.
In addition to having higher rates of
unplanned pregnancy, teenage women
in the United States are more likely
than their peers in the other countries
to want to become mothers. Surveys
indicate that even if only those
teenagers who wanted to become
mothers did so, the resulting teenage
birthrate in the United States (18 per
1,000 women aged 15–19) would still
be higher than the total adolescent
birthrates in France and Sweden and
about two-thirds as high as the total
teenage birthrates in Great Britain
and Canada.
Anyone who is really interested in this subject should definitely access their study. There is also much information to be found on the Planned Parenthood site.

her point was teenage mothers are abundant in europe (or at least in the netherlands)...
I think part of this may be a typo? I thought her point was that there were more teenage pregnancies in the U.S.?

and zero, she would have the best form of proof by living in europe and seeing it for herself (sometimes better proof over "stats")...much closer then you and i...
The only problem I have with this view is that it's very hard to get an over all view of this without statistical evidence. Unless your looking at a very small region it would be impossible to do so otherwise, particularly when you consider the difference from one region to another even within the same country.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #29
interesting, i feel that "statitistics" aren't a realistic portrait of whatever the stats are suppossed to claim on only because it takes a handful of people, not a majority...but that is more an opinion then fact, as i can definitely be wrong...

as a mother myself, i can understand your concern to a certain degree...my kids are 4 & 7, so pregnancy isn't my concern quite yet...but the topic is regarding pornography, and i feel that restricting pornography to people doesn't give our society any good...regulated, yes, in order to "protect" minors, but restrict?
 
  • #30
I think sex is one of the most amazing, rewarding, and wonderful parts of being human. Kids are naturally curious about what sex is, and they should be told. It shouldn't be withheld as a dirty secret.

Now, I'm not suggesting that 7 year olds be shown pornography. What I'm suggesting is that when a 12 year decides (on his or her own) to look at some pornography on the internet, it's not necessary a behavior that should be stopped. As long as it stays within some boundaries:

1) It doesn't become an obsession, which gets in the way of work, or becomes an obstacle to having healthy relationships.

2) It's not the degrading sort of "shock" porn, which really just borders on sexual abuse.

I think it's probably okay. I don't think we should necessarily encourage teenagers to look at porn, but I don't think we should discourage them either.

- Warren
 
  • #31
Wow, this is moving too fast for my once a day visits to this site. Anyway, I find it interesting that many of you think thta the US is too repressed, esp with female sexuality, even though the stats you all keep going on about seem to show that the teen sex rates are the same for the US and Euro, it is only the difference of contraceptives use. Once again I have to disagree, contraceptives use that is important, they are really easy to get in the US, though they are just not handed to you, you have to get it yourself. And the teenagers have spoken, they'd rather be pregnant than embarassed. Even then there are many places that have coin operated contraceptive dispensers in the bathrooms, so no one would even know you bought any if you did. This I feel is very indicative of the stupidity and immaturity of teenagers. I also disagree with chroot, humans for thousands of years were just fine without porn, it isn't necessary, and it is not a luxury that teenagers have a right to, the only rights a teenager has is to a good upbringing: food, clothes, education, love. They have no other rights until they are 18.
I also disagree with kat, who I think said that my indicator was ridiculus. She brought up the case of multigenerational households, but this doesn't apply to my indicator, she has misunderstood what I said:
There is one major indicator in my mind of when it has been long enough: do you still live with mom and dad? If yes, then no.
I did not say, 'do mom and dad live with you?' It depends on who the genreation in their prime is. That generation and older can have sex, those below can't. If I had kids, I wouldn't want them having sex while living under my roof. If this kid is say 16 and wants to have sex, he/she can get a job and move out. If they can do that and don't flounder, then they are ready.
In fact I think that it was better way back when kids were apprenticed in the real world, so by the time they hit puberty they were mature and and ready, and they could avoid this whole problem. Then again people didn't live long back then, so I would change that part if I had completely control over this hypothetical scenario...
 
  • #32
Originally posted by Jonathan
I also disagree with chroot, humans for thousands of years were just fine without porn, it isn't necessary
I never said it was necessary. Furthermore, for thousands of years, sex was practiced out in the open, or, at best, behind a tree. Only in the quite recent past of h. sapiens has sex been "privatized" and been socially deemed appropriate only behind closed doors.
They have no other rights until they are 18.
Spoken like a true American. What's this age, 18? And why does it matter? Who's to say a person becomes sexually capable at 18? How can you draw a line so arbitrarily? Other countries have different lines, and they probably also think their line is best. It's all pretty silly, IMO. It's just sex. If you're emotionally ready to do it, do it -- just do it safely, whatever age you are. There's no way you, or any government, can deem a person ready or not based on their age.
If I had kids, I wouldn't want them having sex while living under my roof. If this kid is say 16 and wants to have sex, he/she can get a job and move out.
You're living in a fantasy world. In our society, people become sexually mature (both physically and emotionally) long before their education is complete. It takes a person 20+ years to become educated these days. Until their education is done, they can't get jobs -- at least not good ones. So you'd rather kick your son or daughter out for doing what is natural at their age, under the reasoning that they shouldn't have sex unless they can support themselves? That seems silly and arbitrary. Being able to hold a good job has nothing to do with being ready for sex.
In fact I think that it was better way back when kids were apprenticed in the real world, so by the time they hit puberty they were mature and and ready
Kids at 16 are just as mature today as apprentices at 16 were in "way back when." The only difference is the educational structure. Sixteen years of education is no longer adequate to be a functioning member of our more advanced society. Once again, none of this has any bearings on sexuality. Quit thinking in terms of "educational maturity," and more in terms of physical and emotional maturity.

- Warren
 
  • #33
1)Sorry, that was the impression I got.
2)You are right, 18 is arbitrary, I was speaking from a legal point of veiw, in which case it doesn't have to make sense, it's the law. :)
3+4)I think you are still misunderstanding what I mean. I was using the emotional capability to cope with the real world as an indicator of one emotional capability to deal with real, serious relationships. Of course it is not the only indicator, it is far more subjective than that (as per #2), but I do think that it is a pretty good indicator.
I didn't say it had to be a good job, what I meant was that they had to be able to get by.
Also, it is not the method of education that was as important as what they learned. I used apprenicship as an example, because it is really in hte real world, you have to deal with real problems like learning the trade, learning how to make good money in this trade, and you would undoubtably see first hand how cruel the real world can be sometimes, as in say a time of war when all the men were out fighting so the economy really got slow. It was not the method of education, but the exposer to the harshness of reality that I am saying is important. Many children brought up today were completely unprepared for the real world by the time they were eightteen, and now 20 years later they are still losers living with their parents. Of course this doesn't happen all the time and there are always exceptions, this was merely a vague indicator and an example. And of course there is such thing as growing up too fast and having the weight of the world on your shoulders that comes with it's own bunch of problems.
 
  • #34
I also disagree with chroot, humans for thousands of years were just fine without porn, it isn't necessary, and it is not a luxury that teenagers have a right to, the only rights a teenager has is to a good upbringing: food, clothes, education, love. They have no other rights until they are 18.

What are you going on about? If you only provide food clothes and education how is the kid supposed to know that you love him/her? I am emotionally mature enough now to know that my parents love me even though all they provide is food, clothes and education, but when i was a very immature young child/teenager i didnt apreciate those things just the luxuries that they gave me.
 
  • #35
Originally posted by Kerrie


and zero, she would have the best form of proof by living in europe and seeing it for herself (sometimes better proof over "stats")...much closer then you and i...
Ummm...what are you talking about?!?
 
Back
Top