About anti-evolution arguments

[Dissident Dan]

This thread is not meant to be a debate on evolution. It is meant to express my argumentative ideas to other evolutionists.

Most, if not all, the nontheistic (however theistic the motives may be) anti-evolution arguments that I've seen rely on the idea that changes in the form of members of a species are limited and cannot add up to a great change that results in a different species.

Besides the fact that such a "great change" is really the composition of many smaller changes, there is one very important aspect to this argument that the pro-evolutionist can use to his/her advantate. This anti-evolution argument relies on thinking only about the manifested form of the creatures (phenotype?), not the DNA. Thinking about this yields a great counterargument:

DNA is the basis for the structure and functions of an organism. DNA is composed of 4 basic building blocks (A,G,C,T). Mutations in DNA have been observed in all the order of these building blocks. Since all DNA is of the same form (an ordered combination of AGCT), if mutation is possible at any place in DNA, it should be possible anywhere in the DNA. This means that there is no restriction on the amount of changes in DNA over an indefinite number of generations (other than natural selection considerations), which means that evolution from one species to another is possible.

 

[Janitor]

Are you talking about point mutations, or whatever they call it when one base pair changes? There is that, and then there are more dramatic mutations as well, I think. An example would be the insertion of a new chunk of base pairs between two base pairs, or the deletion of a chunk. Also, a change in number of chromosomes is pretty dramatic. In this last case, anti-evolutionists like to say: "When and if number of chromosomes can be different in offspring than it was in the parents, what other creature could that unique offspring successfully mate with?" Do biologists have a good answer to that question? Does it require the same exact chromosome number change to occur in some member of the opposite sex within that particular pack of animals, during the same general time period, so that those two can mate? (Same question for sexually reproducing plants.)

 

[R0man]

First of all, I want to thank you for starting this thread and for expressing your argumentative ideas to other evolutionists. It is important to have open and respectful discussions about evolution and its detractors, and I appreciate your efforts to do so.

I completely agree with your point about the limitations of anti-evolution arguments that focus solely on the manifested form of creatures. As you mentioned, these arguments often ignore the role of DNA and the potential for mutations to occur anywhere in the genetic code.

One of the key concepts of evolution is that of natural selection, which acts on the genetic variations within a population. As you stated, mutations can occur anywhere in the DNA, and these variations can be selected for or against depending on their impact on the organism's survival and reproductive success. Over time, these small changes can accumulate and lead to the development of new species.

It is also important to note that evolution is not a linear process, where one species directly transforms into another. Instead, it is a branching process, with species diverging and evolving independently from each other. This is why there can be multiple species that share a common ancestor.

Furthermore, the evidence for evolution is not limited to just the genetic code. Fossil records, comparative anatomy, and biogeography all support the idea of common descent and the gradual changes that have occurred over time.

In summary, your argument about the potential for mutations in DNA to lead to significant changes over time is a strong counterargument to the limited scope of anti-evolution arguments. Evolution is a complex and multifaceted process, and it is important to consider all aspects of it when discussing and debating its validity. Thank you for contributing to this important conversation.